Comments on: The Continuing Saga of the Sales-Challenged Geek http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/ insight, tactics, advice and mutterings on copywriting, marketing and living life deep... from the most ripped-off world-class ad writer alive... Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:13:45 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2 By: Are All Social Marketers Spammers? http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-125813 Are All Social Marketers Spammers? Wed, 21 Nov 2007 19:29:52 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-125813 [...] communities of people have very strong anti-marketing attitudes. Another example can be found in this post on John Carlton's [...] […] communities of people have very strong anti-marketing attitudes. Another example can be found in this post on John Carlton's […]

]]> By: Markus Trauernicht http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-101993 Markus Trauernicht Tue, 14 Aug 2007 16:17:24 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-101993 Hi there I bought Johns "kick-Ass Copywriting Secrets of a Marketing Rebel" a while back. Thought it was utter nonsense but was not too sure. Dec 2006 he was an Underachiever speaker in Melbourne along with Ed and Frank. It made the difference to me. In one salesletter my conversions went up by times 3,3. So much for tracking and testing & using longer copy. I started selling on the web in 2000. So I am not totally new to this. My German degree in Marketing & Engineering - absolutely worthless when it comes to selling on the web. Wasted money! John's stuff WORKS! Suddenly companies call me - please write for us. I had never even mentioned, I could write for others. Recently I spoke to a woman who works for a consulting company - investing in Germany etc. She was upset that someone in her company actually wanted to put in a response element in a €20.000 ad. Latte macchiato club marketing in its finest form. She offered me a job. More than I make now. Nope. Just different worlds. Regards Markus Trauernicht from Berlin Hi there

I bought Johns “kick-Ass Copywriting Secrets of a Marketing Rebel” a while back. Thought it was utter nonsense but was not too sure.

Dec 2006 he was an Underachiever speaker in Melbourne along with Ed and Frank. It made the difference to me. In one salesletter my conversions went up by times 3,3. So much for tracking and testing & using longer copy.

I started selling on the web in 2000. So I am not totally new to this.

My German degree in Marketing & Engineering - absolutely worthless when it comes to selling on the web. Wasted money!

John’s stuff WORKS!

Suddenly companies call me - please write for us. I had never even mentioned, I could write for others.

Recently I spoke to a woman who works for a consulting company - investing in Germany etc. She was upset that someone in her company actually wanted to put in a response element in a €20.000 ad. Latte macchiato club marketing in its finest form. She offered me a job. More than I make now.

Nope.

Just different worlds.

Regards
Markus Trauernicht from Berlin

]]> By: Online Business Blog » Stupid Is As Stupid Does - How Stupid Do Marketers Think You Are? http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-101713 Online Business Blog » Stupid Is As Stupid Does - How Stupid Do Marketers Think You Are? Sun, 12 Aug 2007 16:56:13 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-101713 [...] Internet is a home for a broad range of wildly differing points of view. I was bemused to read John Carlton’s experience of being slagged off on MetaFilter because his sales page was ’spammy’. The MetaFilter tread is about whether long sales [...] […] Internet is a home for a broad range of wildly differing points of view. I was bemused to read John Carlton’s experience of being slagged off on MetaFilter because his sales page was ’spammy’. The MetaFilter tread is about whether long sales […]

]]> By: Why Carlton rules, part 2873.5 | Elizabeth Purvis http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-92385 Why Carlton rules, part 2873.5 | Elizabeth Purvis Wed, 11 Jul 2007 20:27:45 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-92385 [...] The Continuing Saga of the Sales-Challenged Geek Sales-Challenged Geek, Part Deux Add this: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages. [...] […] The Continuing Saga of the Sales-Challenged Geek Sales-Challenged Geek, Part Deux Add this: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages. […]

]]> By: Rob Jacobs http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-91320 Rob Jacobs Mon, 09 Jul 2007 14:18:50 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-91320 I was referred to this blog by a friend of mine, and after noticing this post in my RSS reader and checking it out, I've got to say I'm a little disappointed by what you're pushing here. I was entertained by the anecdote of the outlaw driver flipping everybody off, but you took a whole lot of space to pretty much sell us all on how we should perceive long, get-rich-quick style sales letters on the internet. The people in that nerds forum were both right and wrong. Whether or not long copy sells depends on your market. It may sell great if you have the kind of product that needs it; but if you're selling a product where long sales copy only inundates the sales process, lawn flags for instance, then long copy isn't the way to go. But it does seem that for the hyped up guru's get-rich-quick ebooks, long copy is what ends up selling more. You can get people to buy anything if you throw enough people in front of a letter and keep them reading long enough, but I'm sure it goes without saying that these types of products aren't anything that any of us would want or names on. I don't need to pay you $10,000 for 4 one-hour phone calls in a month. I can already turn a profit on my own and sell products online with proper testing. I was referred to this blog by a friend of mine, and after noticing this post in my RSS reader and checking it out, I’ve got to say I’m a little disappointed by what you’re pushing here.

I was entertained by the anecdote of the outlaw driver flipping everybody off, but you took a whole lot of space to pretty much sell us all on how we should perceive long, get-rich-quick style sales letters on the internet.

The people in that nerds forum were both right and wrong. Whether or not long copy sells depends on your market. It may sell great if you have the kind of product that needs it; but if you’re selling a product where long sales copy only inundates the sales process, lawn flags for instance, then long copy isn’t the way to go.

But it does seem that for the hyped up guru’s get-rich-quick ebooks, long copy is what ends up selling more. You can get people to buy anything if you throw enough people in front of a letter and keep them reading long enough, but I’m sure it goes without saying that these types of products aren’t anything that any of us would want or names on.

I don’t need to pay you $10,000 for 4 one-hour phone calls in a month. I can already turn a profit on my own and sell products online with proper testing.

]]> By: Aviva http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-88997 Aviva Tue, 03 Jul 2007 20:49:39 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-88997 Hi John, I'm really interested by this post of yours because it's raising a question I've started asking myself lately: While I know metrics show that long form copy outsells short form, I'm wondering if there's been a drop off in conversion rates over time. Speaking as a market of one (ya, I know that's bad...), I can say that I was more inclined to buy based on long form copy one year ago, and even six months ago, but find myself less inclined to do so now. It's just starting to feel like an over-inundation. The format feels "done" to me, so that I'm starting to suspect it rather than to trust it. Am I alone? Would be interested to know... Hi John,

I’m really interested by this post of yours because it’s raising a question I’ve started asking myself lately: While I know metrics show that long form copy outsells short form, I’m wondering if there’s been a drop off in conversion rates over time.

Speaking as a market of one (ya, I know that’s bad…), I can say that I was more inclined to buy based on long form copy one year ago, and even six months ago, but find myself less inclined to do so now. It’s just starting to feel like an over-inundation. The format feels “done” to me, so that I’m starting to suspect it rather than to trust it. Am I alone? Would be interested to know…

]]> By: Philip http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87843 Philip Sat, 30 Jun 2007 11:26:43 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87843 Hey John, You know, this could be a positive thing. Think about it The more madison avenue type advertisers there are, the more opportunities for us! If people want to believe that they will make more money with flashy ads than with direct response ads, then... that just less competition for us! At least that's the way I see it Bottom line, we direct marketers can CRUSH the graphic designers in one swift motion... which means... we can DOMINATE more markets. So, this could be good for business. You know, im not suprised sales were up because traffic was up... your just too damn good! Even people who hate direct response STILL have the money sucked right out of their pockets by your copy... its just that goods. By the way, maybe you could switch the Please add x and x to something like x + x = what? because i didnt get what the hell the form was asking for at first. Hey John,

You know, this could be a positive thing.

Think about it

The more madison avenue type advertisers there are, the more opportunities for us!

If people want to believe that they will make more money with flashy ads than with direct response ads, then… that just less competition for us!

At least that’s the way I see it

Bottom line, we direct marketers can CRUSH the graphic designers in one swift motion… which means… we can DOMINATE more markets.

So, this could be good for business.

You know, im not suprised sales were up because traffic was up… your just too damn good!

Even people who hate direct response STILL have the money sucked right out of their pockets by your copy… its just that goods.

By the way, maybe you could switch the Please add x and x to something like x + x = what? because i didnt get what the hell the form was asking for at first.

]]> By: john-carlton http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87719 john-carlton Sat, 30 Jun 2007 04:58:17 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87719 Hi Ryan. Yeah, sales were up a bit, too... but we can't tell if there's a direct correlation to the MeFi thread, and it would be dishonest to claim there is. In other words, I can't tell you how many geeks came over to gloat and be horrified, and then bought. My instinct says some did, but they aren't about to cop to it... It's probably like that AC/DC album I had to hide from my hard-core classic rock and jazz-afficionado friends back in the early 80s -- around those friends, I had to pretend to be shocked by the dismal state of affairs in rock at that time... but when they left, I played Back In Black until the grooves melted... Hi Ryan. Yeah, sales were up a bit, too… but we can’t tell if there’s a direct correlation to the MeFi thread, and it would be dishonest to claim there is. In other words, I can’t tell you how many geeks came over to gloat and be horrified, and then bought. My instinct says some did, but they aren’t about to cop to it…

It’s probably like that AC/DC album I had to hide from my hard-core classic rock and jazz-afficionado friends back in the early 80s — around those friends, I had to pretend to be shocked by the dismal state of affairs in rock at that time… but when they left, I played Back In Black until the grooves melted…

]]> By: Ryan http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87659 Ryan Sat, 30 Jun 2007 01:47:33 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87659 Hey John, Just a quick question... You mentioned traffic was up... Were sales? THAT would be priceless. -A brain addled reader Hey John,

Just a quick question…

You mentioned traffic was up… Were sales?

THAT would be priceless.

-A brain addled reader

]]> By: Long Copy » client k http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87370 Long Copy » client k Fri, 29 Jun 2007 10:08:57 +0000 http://www.john-carlton.com/2007/06/27/the-continuing-saga-of-the-sales-challenged-geek/#comment-87370 [...] John Carlton weighs in again on long copy vs short copy (long copy won years ago),  he reminds us that [...] […] John Carlton weighs in again on long copy vs short copy (long copy won years ago),  he reminds us that […]

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